tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-21976303.post674159759717673013..comments2024-03-24T05:22:27.179-04:00Comments on Orthonomics: Orthonomicshttp://www.blogger.com/profile/07892074485262548496noreply@blogger.comBlogger13125tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-21976303.post-45118875325774784682009-04-22T21:47:00.000-04:002009-04-22T21:47:00.000-04:00anon - the federation gave money to yeshivas in be...anon - the federation gave money to yeshivas in bergen county - apparently not enough to prevent bergen county yeshivas from having one of the highest - most unaffordable tuitions in the USA <br /><br />give me a break - what percentage of bergen county federation money goes to yeshivas ? 5 % - if that - even 20% would not cut it or make a dent in yeshiva tuition costs - and most federation donors are not orthodox and are not interested in helping yeshivas anyway - the chasidim have the only viable midelAnonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-21976303.post-72362887767952149852009-04-22T16:48:00.000-04:002009-04-22T16:48:00.000-04:00in bergen county, the federation helps all of the ...in bergen county, the federation helps all of the orthdox schools infact a couple of years ago, they gave a large grant to maayanot to keep it afloat.<br /><br /><br />in frisch they have coed davening with a mechitzah, whats so terrible about coed davening.<br />dont we have that in our shuls now?Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-21976303.post-76550237761704138282009-04-22T12:18:00.000-04:002009-04-22T12:18:00.000-04:00On this issue, I think Rosie is right. I have chi...On this issue, I think Rosie is right. I have children who go to a conservative (actually community) day school and the price is higher than the local orthodox day school or yeshiva (by a reasonably large amount).<br /><br />Separate classes (except for gym which is mostly separate at the upper school level) would not happen.<br /><br />Separate davening is not a problem, with many choices available from reform egalitarian to orthodox with mechitzah.<br /><br />But unless the schools were each half full, so that combining would save money on space and back office personnel, a combination would not save any money.<br /><br />I also have a child in public school (for a variety of reasons, not financial). I do wish (and think some conservative and some orthodox parents wish) there was something in between day school and just talmud torah. Maybe a talmud torah that met four or five times a week (fifth on Sunday morning) rather than just twice a week. <br /><br />While many would find that inadequate, it would still be better than talmud torah (and cheaper than day school).conservative scifinoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-21976303.post-47399617293008021552009-04-22T11:50:00.000-04:002009-04-22T11:50:00.000-04:00anon819, the Conservative day schools where I live...anon819, the Conservative day schools where I live charge more than the Orthodox ones do. Combining with them would not necessarily bring down the cost of Chinuch. Not only that but many Orthodox run schools have separate gender classrooms or buildings. The genders can be mixed before bar or bat mitzvah, or some allow it until age 9 but this is where chumrahs can get in the way of a community school. Even in the MO b'nei Akiva school, the genders daven separately in high school. A community school would have to offer the Orthodox that option.rosiehttps://www.blogger.com/profile/03750230430610565818noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-21976303.post-58218929457975071082009-04-22T10:47:00.000-04:002009-04-22T10:47:00.000-04:00(the other "Avi") I'm all for the power of technol...(the other "Avi") I'm all for the power of technology to mobilize action, but this just seems like a way for people to kvetch, not to actually accomplish anything.Avinoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-21976303.post-5561462858129744702009-04-22T10:35:00.000-04:002009-04-22T10:35:00.000-04:00Avi,
There is a group on Facebook about this as w...Avi,<br /><br />There is a group on Facebook about this as well. It's called something like "yeshiva tuition is too expensive" or something to that effect.<br /><br />While I applaud your efforts, the yeshivas and day schools already know there is a problem. The article about Kushner on the previous post indicated at least 33% were receiving tuition assistance. I'm sure that statistic is the same or higher at other schools.<br /><br />The fact remains that to keep the current model there is only one solution: money. Schools need to raise more of it, families need to earn more of it. On top of that, budgets need to be cut and money needs to be kept in the community. However, this is a long-term plan to a near-term problem. And besides, I don't think it would even work. The facts are that it's expensive to run a school properly.<br /><br />That leaves you with alternative options which are also already known: public school, charter schools, home schooling, after school programs. There's too much resistance from within for this to be an accepted solution at this point and I think even the proponents acknowledge it's a "b'dieved" solution.<br /><br />In short, I don't know what the community as a whole can do. I think individual parents need to make the choices for themselves and perhaps a solution will emerge from that. But it's not gonna come from the leadership in my opinion which simply has too much to lose if something else replaces the current system.JSnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-21976303.post-13689236689941976622009-04-22T10:32:00.000-04:002009-04-22T10:32:00.000-04:00Hate to agree that this won't serve much of a ...Hate to agree that this won't serve much of a purpose, since it really is well-meaning. But:<br /><br />Administrators & Rabbis - no interets in thinking outside the box. interest is their own institutions (as mentioned above - this is not a bad thing, just natural to watch out for your own parnassa)<br /><br />Lay leaders - who would that be? Most of the "machers" in a community are strongly associated with a specific school/yeshiva.<br /><br />Federation - also as mentioned above, if you are only talking about the Orthodox schooling system, there is not going to be the help from the Federation. (By the way, with all the suggestions we've been bringing up on Orthonomics, I have yet to see even one person suggest any cooperation with the Conservative day schools.)<br /><br />Parents - that's the main issue, but instead of signing a petition, parents need to be willing to take real action. If none of these people would actually be willing to pull their kid out of their current school for any reason, why should the schools care?Anon819noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-21976303.post-10062898148886765692009-04-22T10:04:00.000-04:002009-04-22T10:04:00.000-04:00tesyaa-I'm working on a post. I don't see homemak...tesyaa-I'm working on a post. I don't see homemaking for Dads becoming a norm because it isn't natural. I do think an increased role should be considered where men get laid off or aren't making it, at least in the short term. <br /><br />There is a new report out that 80% of all layoffs due to the recession involve male employees. Certainly something that means the model is a changing.Orthonomicshttps://www.blogger.com/profile/07892074485262548496noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-21976303.post-74443839738629755062009-04-22T09:54:00.000-04:002009-04-22T09:54:00.000-04:00SL, I left a comment at MII about your SAHD commen...SL, I left a comment at MII about your SAHD comment. I think a post by you on the topic is a fine idea, but I have my own thoughts.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-21976303.post-84530383406898736692009-04-22T09:53:00.000-04:002009-04-22T09:53:00.000-04:00Hi, I am the one that wrote the petition and someo...Hi, I am the one that wrote the petition and someone alerted me to this blog. So I thought I'd take the opportunity to answer your questions.<br /><br />This petition was written more to quantify the number of people for whom this topic is of concern. The idea is to take the private conversations and aggregate them. And, if there are enough signatures here, this petition will demonstrate to the leaders of each school and community the need to seriously address this issue.<br /><br />The petition is not proposing or endorsing any specific ideas other than a long-term, sustainable model.<br /><br />Challenging times create the necessity and opportunity to implement change. <br /><br />Every possible option, including the status quo, is not without risk. So we must continue the search for a more sustainable solution.Avinoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-21976303.post-36589406983697066132009-04-22T08:40:00.000-04:002009-04-22T08:40:00.000-04:00I am glad to see that there is a recognition of th...I am glad to see that there is a recognition of the role that day schools play in "ensuring continuity in the American Jewish community."<br />Are the undersigned ready to form co-op schools? Administrators have their own wallets to protect. They are not looking forward to having their jobs eliminated or their salaries cut. <br />Are those parents willing to make a community day school that would attract the non-Orthodox? That would obviously be more palatable to the Federations. <br />Whose radical ideas are going to be considered?rosiehttps://www.blogger.com/profile/03750230430610565818noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-21976303.post-903143701351475322009-04-22T08:39:00.000-04:002009-04-22T08:39:00.000-04:00Good comments Yael. I don't have the answers. I'...Good comments Yael. I don't have the answers. I'm not sure what great changes a petition can elicit. Money, of course, is louder than words.Orthonomicshttps://www.blogger.com/profile/07892074485262548496noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-21976303.post-31607491456505870492009-04-22T08:33:00.000-04:002009-04-22T08:33:00.000-04:00To whom will this petition be sent? There is no c...To whom will this petition be sent? There is no central Jewish educational body that oversees things at every (or even most) Jewish day school in America/Canada. Even Torah u'Mesorah doesn't play this role. <br /><br />And more importantly, what out of the box changes has anyone come up with that don't have major challenges up against them? <br /><br />And, no, I don't expect everyone to homeschool. :)Yaelhttp://groups.yahoo.com/group/jewishorthodoxandhomeschooling/noreply@blogger.com